176. Spartus Spitfire, Inferno 2, Joola FX News & Questions and Answers

[00:00:03] All right, what's up guys? We are back with another podcast episode this week. Today we're going to be talking about some interesting things I've just observed about paddle grit recently or maybe like a little theory I have about grit as well as a handful of paddles. The Joola FX information has been released talking about the Spartus Spitfire which a lot of you have wanted us to cover the Inferno 2 and then talking a little bit about the Valeric Command now that I have a weight set up on it and then we're going to dive into just our review process because with how many

[00:00:31] of you were asking about the Spitfire and being like why haven't you hit it yet? Why haven't you hit it yet? I was like you know what we should probably go over this again and just talk about kind of a deep dive on our whole thing and then in the kitchen we'll have some Q&A. But before we get into that I do have a question this week that I'd be very curious to know the answer in the comments and that is how long does it typically take for you to notice your paddle losing spin and what level

[00:00:53] are you? And especially what I want to know is how long it takes you to notice if you are not touching the face of your paddle because I think there are a lot of instances where someone could not touch the face of their paddle they might not be thinking about it as much but because everyone's always you know kind of touching their face like oh is it smooth is it not I feel like that'll put some stuff in your head a little bit so just let me know how long it takes for you to notice and then what your

[00:01:19] level is because I'm very curious. So all right first thing I want to talk about is just paddle spin. So obviously I've been doing a ton of grit testing recently there's all these long lasting grits some that are still not and I had an interesting thought recently we're going to talk a little bit more about this when we get to the Spitfire because that is definitely a paddle that's sparked a little bit of

[00:01:41] this debate but I'm starting to wonder so there are paddles like the 6-0 Coral Pro and 11-624s hex grit that are when you touch them it's a very like coarse grit the grit pieces all feel very big and you know it'll feel very rough to the touch and then there is other types of grit where if we're talking about like the peaks and valleys the way I think about it is you have some that are just like

[00:02:11] bigger wider pieces of grit and then you have ones that are really sharp but really narrow and I think for durable grit to my hunch so far I don't know that this is correct here I'm completely spitballing is if it is a wider piece you can have you know more embedded grit particle it'll make it stronger if it's very narrow but very sharp it'll be easier to snap the tip but I'm starting to feel like those

[00:02:35] sharper tips that don't they feel rough but maybe not ultra rough are almost better for high performance spin but maybe not long lasting because even paddles that are you know quote unquote maybe smooth something that I've been noticing with again you know my silly little test of like dragging my hand across the face not that scientific but I have consistently found that even paddles with very

[00:03:02] smooth grit if I do that my handle like not move like it does not want to slide across the face and then some of these paddles with you know objectively very rough textures my hand will slide across it a little bit more not like oh it's slipping a ton but it'll just it'll move right and hex grid is one of those obviously it gets great spin so I'm not trying to say oh these get worse spin but I am wondering if there's going to be a difference between what is really durable and what is hyper

[00:03:28] performative and if those are going to clash with each other or not because some of these sharper more narrow peaks paddles they feel like they get better spin to me I guess it comes down to excuse me comes down to what's the the line at you draw being high performance yeah like okay let's say

[00:03:51] in theory the sharper peaks do at first hit and first few games fresh get more spin and more effective spin and it's let's just throw a number 2600 mm-hmm but then the more durable grits are getting 2400 mm-hmm is that yeah big enough difference for you because in my opinion anything over 2300 is all great

[00:04:16] I mean I would say even over 2100 is plenty fine yeah you know so I don't know it depends on what you where you draw the line yeah I think it's gonna be interesting more is always better yeah of course and I feel like this conversation is going to continue to evolve like I I think I would have put money on by the end of this year durable grit would have largely been solved but I actually feel like

[00:04:39] I'm gonna say that it's gonna take another year at minimum before we really know one consistently that some of these are really long lasting or two that they're really long lasting and very high performance yeah like I don't know I'm just I'm very curious I feel like that gap is gonna be a little bit split and I still think there is like the interesting conversation of uh you know all the spin tests right now

[00:05:06] are from a baseline hitting serves that's obviously a smaller portion of the game maybe that's more realistic for something like singles but doubles is played at the kitchen line and so are some of these grits gonna be a little bit better at the kitchen line versus not you know like just it's very interesting I feel like as I continue to test more and more paddles for all this grit stuff I'm just like picking up on smaller things that I'm like hmm I feel like this is gonna this conversation might look

[00:05:33] different next year yeah I mean they're definitely different grit textures that are better at certain shots than others right like the p1 and was it permagrit yeah is in my opinion much better at slower swing speed like mid-court rolls than hex grit but they're both great performative grits on spin yeah but I think permagrit is just better at the like getting spin at the kitchen yeah yeah it's gonna be so

[00:06:00] interesting to see I really wish we also had like a usap was doing this for a bit and I think selkirk also has one but one of those 3d scanners to kind of look at a lot of these grits because it'd be very interesting to see them at that granular level to kind of know because I mean the spitfire is one in particular that I think it is a it is a rough textured paddle it's not you know super smooth but if you touch that versus hex grit there's a very big difference in how those feel to the touch with

[00:06:27] your hand one feels more fine one feels more coarse like I was saying right and the other thing that made me think about this this morning is there are a lot of sports where I feel like the most performative equipment is not the most durable and so like I one example that came to my mind which look I'm not a runner but I feel like I know enough runners to have had this said to me and then I looked it up just to verify really quick is there are foam shoes for like marathons I think a lot of

[00:06:57] times they get called super shoes and basically it's like these are not going to last you very long but for that race they are going to be faster and return more energy but that is not the shoe you're going to train in yeah you're going to train in I think it's like a tpu shoe versus uh let me see did I write this down where's Justin when you need him seriously um I think it's the the like super shoes have a carbon plate and they're like a peba or p-e-b-a foam uh so it's just very

[00:07:25] interesting like running is an example of hey look you're going to run in something different than or train in something different than what you would actually do the race with and I imagine as an obvious example I'm not a runner here if I started running it doesn't matter if I run in that tpu style shoe or if I run in the super shoe like I'm probably not going to be that much better in a super shoe because my running technique just sucks right and so I think that's going to apply to pickleball as well I mean my example is going to be the same thing shoes in pickleball for me

[00:07:53] not shoes and pickleball is very different for everybody I imagine running is as well but jet mock threes are the most performative shoe for me and I know a lot of people agree and say the same thing but durability is very lackluster I mean I go I can burn through the outsole of those in about two and a half to three weeks yeah but I will play in those for tournaments because it is the best shoe for me yeah but then there are shoes that will last maybe two months but feel like bricks on my feet

[00:08:21] yeah and I can't I just can't play well with them yeah so it's a trade-off and just like some other brief research I did it seemed like this applied in a lot of other sports as well now granted these are very quick searches so don't uh take my word entirely for this but it sounds like table tennis has a similar thing with different rubbers where there are some where like performance and spin is very good but it might only last a couple weeks and then one that you might actually use very regularly or last longer

[00:08:46] is not going to get as high of spin uh same thing I think I saw with swimming um and golf balls it sounds like some of the tour balls they'll be softer get better spin but like they might scuff easier or something so yeah I'm just seeing a trend with other sports where the highest performing is not the most durable and I'm very curious to see how that pans out for pickleball you know like it it makes me even

[00:09:12] think you know the reload concept never took off I think not because the concept itself was bad I think the concept was good they just failed to innovate on the paddle side like I feel like even with all the foam paddles now like think how light some of these are like uh I mean think the quanta pro last year think how ridiculously light those were you take the you know regular carbon fiber face off that and then slap a reload sheet on it might not have been that heavy yeah and could have potentially been a

[00:09:40] really performing good performing paddle so it makes me wonder too if we'll ever see that come back now that cores are lasting longer like okay here are the different types of grit you could have let's just slap it on this face and then it's more like a tennis string or something I don't know I'm very curious to see where this will be in a year we'll have to like revisit you know I'm gonna set a room I'll do my classic apple reminder thing remind me in one year to see what has happened to

[00:10:06] pickleball paddle grit for the podcast nice there we go all right got it also I will say for performance versus durability it also just drastically depends on where you at where you are at in skill level amongst all sports right so like tennis I'm probably a three five to four oh tennis player

[00:10:29] and I'm not breaking strings nearly as fast as Alcaraz or center yeah right like you can give me the same string setup and I guarantee I won't break a string in probably months yeah but they're gonna break it in a day yeah you know or golf balls I guarantee that Scotty Scheffler is gonna scuff up those balls with his with his wedges way faster than I will just because contacts cleaner swing is better just everything so

[00:10:53] it just really depends on what level you're at on how long equipment will last yeah so I'm very curious to say I mean we've already seen this a little bit I would say in my opinion it's not so much definitive performance however at least you know a year ago there was a very clear preference towards some of these gen 3 paddles and they were obviously breaking quickly so okay hey you could argue that that is an example of the pros don't really care about the longer lasting one because

[00:11:22] they think it performs better now some of that I think to me is more about they're used to it rather than it being definitively performing better like I feel like there are so many foam paddles now that are on par if not better than a lot of different gen 3s but I do think preference will obviously still play a role in that yeah so maybe not a perfect example but it's one you could you could probably argue right like they break but they don't care because they can get as many as they want you might care

[00:11:48] as an amateur because you have to replace it they do the same thing with grit think about like they there I know some players yeah on tour who quite literally use a new paddle every to every other match yeah they bring 20 to 25 paddles with them and they swap it out after each match yep that's how it is they want the highest performing paddle for each match possible totally uh last thing I guess

[00:12:13] I'll wrap this uh segment up with is I I was saying this earlier about it seems like friction is higher on the lower grip paddles which again various engineers have said this for years I mean even I would I could probably think of conversations as early back as 2022 talking to Rafa from Gearbox and he'd be like grit doesn't matter we don't need it I'm like well I think it does matter I but there is I think it's just up to a certain point with how it used to be in 2022 it was so smooth that I feel

[00:12:41] like any amount of grit was like it's gonna be better but now that again we can kind of go crazy on the grit now I feel like we're for the first time ever starting to see oh okay hang on things like friction are actually going down with this much grit but so many consumers are so used to just touching the face and going is there grit ah grit good but I wonder if it's going to swing back at some point where people start going well wait this paddle actually is really rough but I'm actually

[00:13:06] not getting as much spin as like a slightly smoother paddle that I used to have I'm not talking ultra smooth I'm not talking zero grit you know I feel like people view this very black and white it's either no grit and it's smooth as glass or it's ultra rough and I'm like there's a big middle area here that is being overlooked trying to think what other sport is there a piece of equipment where people will grab from someone just touch it and immediately cancel it out like from like nope I don't even want to

[00:13:35] use it just off of a feel thing like touching it I do wonder what other like sports are like that I don't know enough about various sports to see that but it's got to exist I'm trying to think there's there's got to be some other table tennis maybe with like how like much your hand sticks to it yes and no I don't know there's got to be something very similar but I can't think of anything imagine someone touching a tennis racket they're putting their hand over the string like nah

[00:14:02] right forget this I mean maybe like no but then tension I don't know there's it doesn't if you guys can think of anything comment it below because right now my brain I just can't yeah it's a funny one yeah my prediction is it's going to be a bit before all the grit conversation solved I think yeah I think at least another year yeah is my guess we'll have good stuff in the meantime I'm not talking about it's bad but I think it's going to continue to advance yeah until it's an industry wide thing it's going to be a while yeah there will only be a handful of brands that are doing

[00:14:31] it well for the first few years yep first year yep so all right let's move on to some paddle stuff here so first thing I just want to talk about uh I saw pickleball central was doing a sale on pro fours I think this might actually be the lowest price that I've ever seen like former flagship uh models of yolas but the pro fours I think there's only a handful of shapes left it was like

[00:14:57] don't quote me on this but it was like perseus hyperion scorpius and then in uh varying thicknesses uh there might have might have even been a magnus I'm not sure but anyways I'll leave it linked down below but they're down to like 150 150 for a pro four great deal in my opinion that's crazy like I do think there are a lot of other paddles to consider especially with longer lasting grit but if you're someone who likes yolas you didn't really like the pro five bro I'd be loading up on those

[00:15:22] pro fours bro the more I just it's it's so funny I look at yola and different paddle brands like tech brands okay like yola is like the apple okay of of the industry and it's like yeah you don't need the new iphone you don't need the 18 pro you don't need the duo you go back to 17 yeah just go by last year's it's all it's like half off yeah you know that that's a funny point it's like dude 150 for

[00:15:48] if you really like yola and want a gen 3 then dude 150 is pretty good deal and to me I again I mean I feel like I've we've talked about this I feel like there were the pro four to pro five was probably one of the first yola paddles where there was a much bigger debate about like do you like the pro five or do you like the pro four more usually in the past it was the newest one was always oh this is clearly better uh so again good sale I don't know how long it's going to last there were like I said there were a number of them that were already sold out so probably I'm guessing it probably won't last

[00:16:18] even like another week but yeah I just thought I'd mention it because I thought that was a pretty good deal and pretty low price for what I've seen yola's historically yeah so okay uh let's move on to the yola fx because more information got dropped on that so it is now confirmed uh 180 dollar price point and then the build is a propulsion core diving board foam probably everyone could have predicted that considering the propulsion core is kind of their thing uh and then it's an epp foam core center

[00:16:46] and then looking at the website like that's about as clear as it got it the image that they show was a little vague to me but it almost looks like they have the full you know thermo form wrapped ring like that foam goes all the way around I wouldn't say that's necessarily new for them either but they continued with that and then it's also only coming in the perseus shape at least from what's on

[00:17:08] the website or not get that I'm not saying anything I'm not saying anything uh but so seeing this I would say not really a lot of surprises there again they didn't have the durable grit at least they didn't if it is on it they didn't mention it yep but again I highly doubt they're doing that at 180 there's no way they're putting that on their non-flagship paddle yeah you know that makes sense I think

[00:17:34] it's funny I feel like YOLO will often people are probably going to go oh why didn't they put the durable grit option on this but what is interesting to me is YOLO follows what like every other industry in the world does which is hey our flagship product that's the only one that gets flagship item and you're gonna play pay flagship price yep but people have gotten so used to so many companies going oh here's a durable grit at 99 so now everyone expects like well why doesn't their mid-tier

[00:18:03] item have the the best features you know yeah it's a very not a lot of other industries are like that if you pay less you usually getting something a little bit worse right when it comes to at least mainstay it just it doesn't make sense them dropping a foam paddle like this this construction and this price because when we were at YOLO for the pro 5 launch we were asking them questions

[00:18:33] and I was like okay when are you guys thinking about dropping a foam paddle blah blah and their answer was well YOLO is kind of the innovative innovators innovators of the industry gosh I can't talk this morning and unless they can innovate on foam they don't want to make it and I'm like okay what are you innovating with this yeah there is nothing new here like okay the thriving night

[00:18:59] right that's a diving board style foam core so I wonder are they listed in YOLO's lawsuit they weren't but I can't remember who I was talking to a while ago but they pointed out if I'm recalling correctly all of the brands that were listed were all brands that have pros that play PPA so it seemed like maybe highest priority was go after the ones impacting tour yeah so I'm like okay it's nothing

[00:19:25] that special or new so what's what's what are you innovating I had the same thought when I looked at it because it just I mean they said that a bunch like you know we don't want to just do foam like everyone else like if we want to do foam we want to you know make a bigger entrance so to me I'm like what what's the entrance here so my my theory is let's let's just say this performs just as good

[00:19:51] as the thriving night plays just like a thriving night the only way that this paddle does not eat into their flagship sales is by them marketing it in a way to people that aren't nerds like us to put it down and below their flagship paddle that is the only way it does not absolutely cannibalize

[00:20:17] their flagship model yeah I'll be really curious to see I don't think they're gonna do that like I the way it's been marketed so far I don't see anything that's like oh it's lesser than you know our pro 5 or you know whatever so I guess it's just gonna come down to how it performs it'll be very interesting to see like I hope it's good no one wants it to be bad right right like I feel like Yola I'm saying they need a hit as if they're not like the most popular brand in pickleball right but

[00:20:44] it it is reminding me to a much lesser degree of what was happening to Selkirk for a long time like Selkirk was just in the gutter for years like I feel like every paddle they released it was like this sucks this sucks why did you do it this way why did you do this way Yola has not done a this sucks it's more a why are you falling behind is what it feels like yeah but I feel like Yola is also like the beginning stages will happen to Selkirk but what's interesting though I think what makes

[00:21:14] it different or maybe why we're seeing some of what we see is think how much Yola is catering to their pros I feel like when they release a paddle like they're not releasing something at least in their flagship line unless their pros are saying I will use this this is good yeah right can you imagine if came out and every single one of their top pros said yeah I'm just gonna stick with the pro 4

[00:21:36] that'd be a terrible look and I think just what the pros want and what either nerds want or amateurs want is just different I mean how many times have we seen this well one with pros just continuing to prefer gen 3 and not necessarily loving film though that conversation is kind of it's not even really the case anymore but whatever you know we'll pretend that's still the case I feel like just who they're catering towards is different than most companies like Selkirk now not really catering to any pros

[00:22:06] sure you know I mean I I can understand that point but at the same time with a lot of the pros that I've talked to some some people don't necessarily see that big of a difference in performance and just would rather stick with what they're used to 100% and change so it's not that like oh foam is worse and not good enough for pros it's just I'm used to this I'm just gonna stick with it and if it's not

[00:22:33] gonna make me better yeah what's the point and they don't need it to be more durable they get free paddles so but then we're still seeing tons of pros that are switching to foam yeah so I don't know I don't really think there's a good argument of like gen 3s are clearly better for high level because pros use them pros a lot of pros are using foam yeah so I don't know I mean guess we'll see like

[00:22:58] as soon as it comes out we'll buy one and we'll try and make some content about it but uh yeah it was just kind of confusing I was maybe expecting some like newer type of tech but not even I think a lot of people can get hung up on I actually saw this on um a bread and butter post this week it was an Instagram post they were talking about like upcoming loco 2 information and someone in the comments said something like oh all you're doing is adding long lasting grit and no new tech like I don't want

[00:23:26] this and in my mind I'm going if you make this with a truly better long lasting grit that is all the loco needs to still be relevant in 2026 and probably 2027 so I feel like people can get hung up on it's almost like the iPhone I always laugh when people go they didn't they didn't change the design of it I'm like well what does the design of it matter like you know like it doesn't assuming it's not a terrible design let's just yeah take phones as an example let's just say

[00:23:55] whatever phone company you use Samsung Android iPhone doesn't matter and you you've been using your phone for a little while and the company you use says comes out with a new one and says okay we have the forever battery battery will last forever we didn't change anything else but your battery will never die everyone would be like that's insane I'm buying that immediately yeah right like there's not a single person that would be like meh yeah right I think everyone on the planet

[00:24:24] would be like yeah I'd love to not have to charge my phone anymore yeah so like if grit truly lasted forever and never lost spin people should be like that's amazing yeah so to me like I think we're making assumptions here based on other paddles like oh okay so you just did EPP foam core you did a diving board foam we probably have like a ballpark idea of how we think this paddle will play who knows what they did with the face layup maybe there's some interesting things there but I think people

[00:24:51] will immediately see that us included and go oh we didn't do anything that great how good could the paddle play but I don't think you need to do something crazy with the internals for the paddle to play well I mean look look at the wall how many of these are just a full floating ring with an EPP or MPP center and how many of them all play awesome well when foam cores started initially coming around the more simple it was the better it was right like a lot of the apes paddles yeah had these crazy

[00:25:19] incisions and cuts and lines and all this weird stuff didn't play better we didn't they didn't play better or we didn't like them as much but then let's just take a loco very simple EPP core foam ring one of the best paddles we played with yep yep it's like don't don't over complicate the wheel yeah so I don't know be interesting to see uh we got what here probably about another week until it

[00:25:45] can be purchased and unless some local stores are going to be carrying it probably a couple more days after that before we can actually hit it yeah but I'm curious either way I'm very curious to see how it plays see what happens um yeah we'll go from there all right let's talk about some paddles we actually hit this week so spartus the spitfire this has probably been the number one most requested paddle since I've come back I don't think I've had a paddle that's been more requested than the

[00:26:12] spitfire and I get it you know it's a hundred dollars and it's got a lot going for it so you started hitting the elongated last week and then I've been waiting for the wide body to show up so we could do both at the same time I didn't want to make a video about the elongated then have to make a video about the wide body I was like let's just do this all at once yeah um so okay most of you already know this since the paddle's been out for a while it's 109 before discount code

[00:26:35] on the wide body here the swing weight is 107 and the static weight is 7.8 ounces so very light very maneuverable the same thing with the elongated I think our first uh elongated spitfire was like a 115 swing weight so that's you know also pretty low so I feel like you have a lot of options to customize um first thing I got to talk about before I let you get into your talking about the play with

[00:26:59] the paddle so with all of this these grit issues going on I have just gotten to the point where I'm like we have to buy our own paddles we have been doing this for a while uh like paddles here there that we'll just buy ourselves which is fine and with all the grit stuff I was like I need to know I'm getting whatever the consumer is buying so I've started doing that and so I bought another elongated spitfire and this wide body was one that was sent to us so I went to do spin tests yesterday

[00:27:28] and holy moly this thing rips spin I I mean the first one I tested of yours was already really good and if I didn't order in elongated I would have thought this paddle was like a juiced oh they did something weird to this because I was averaging 2500 rpm with this thing with a good number of results in the like with 2700 with the wide body I'm very curious because the surface of this does feel

[00:27:53] slightly different than mine but if you have it I compared it with the new elongated I got after the pot I'll have to go grab mine because this feels slightly different yeah I have to grab yours and compare a little bit to me it felt the same as the one I bought but curious what aggregate they're adding into this because it is like slightly shiny and sparkly and reflective like uh diamond tough yeah I'm curious as well but yeah the elongated also came at 2500 yeah so I think most of the some of

[00:28:22] these numbers going up because I feel like for the longest time I averaged the like 2100 2200 but I've been hitting so many serves one because of uh grit testing or spin testing but then also before I came back from injury there was a lot of serve stuff that I was doing and I was kind of messing with my technique and I think I've just found some better ways to get spin so some of that I don't think is necessarily the paddle some of that I think is I've just recently found ways to improve my serve which

[00:28:50] I had never really focused on but either way I felt like I could literally swing as hard as I wanted and this ball was not going out like I was shocked at the spin I was getting from this like I just like I had multiple paddles and I would test other paddles and I'm like okay I'm not crazy like this one's getting the spin I expect spitfire still getting the spin I expect like to spin reps on this and it's crazy yeah um yeah that's just wild so anyways I'll let you talk about it because you have a little

[00:29:17] bit more play time and then I'll talk about my experience yesterday yeah I had a it's funny you say that I had a drill session the other day um and probably the back half of the drill session I was just at the baseline hitting drives it did feel really good I don't know what it is recently my drive has just felt good with every paddle I play with but uh the spitfire was was very good um I've probably got just under 30 games on it now yeah uh no wait I've played it completely stock

[00:29:44] uh it is a little light for me I probably will I mean I did add a weight setup I just haven't played any games with it yet um I might mess around and change change that up a bit but so far it's been good sweet spot I've had zero complaints uh it's not the most powerful paddle on the market so it's not like difficult to control there are some times where trying to put the ball away can be a little

[00:30:07] bit difficult when I'm playing outside um spin has been phenomenal I haven't you know clearly noticed a big drop off it's only been 25 30 games so still early I'd hope yeah not a big difference yet that'd be that'd be bad it'd be like uh the v souls all over again yeah so yeah it's been it's been good I haven't really had any complaints not my favorite shape of all time it's kind of that

[00:30:31] shorter handle elongated kind of like it's not what is it same as like the pressure x the gearbox I thought it was like the same as everything else no I remember the other day I was showing you it's like the exact same shape as the the gearboxes pressure not like as short as a magnus yeah but not same handle length as uh like the I'm trying to think of something like a loco I feel like hmm okay yeah we'll have to hold those up later yeah maybe I'm wrong but it feels a little bit

[00:30:59] shorter on the the throat taper for a two-y um I seriously for 100 bucks have zero complaints this is probably one of the best hundred dollar paddles I've used yeah that's pretty much yeah I was gonna say a very similar thing so uh I have only drilled with the wide body once yesterday so I'm basing my current thoughts uh off of that uh but I will you know obviously continue to get more

[00:31:22] play time on this thing but yeah I feel like so light paddles I feel like there's always this not always I was actually having this conversation with um Justin the other day it's very interesting so obviously the shift or not the shift the command is pretty light out of the box pretty low swing weight for a hybrid pretty low static weight and I was like yeah I feel like this has some sweet spot issues it's not like horrible but it's like yeah it's not as good as other paddles out there

[00:31:51] and then once you add weight which we'll get to it's completely fine but I do think there are paddles like an aerial cyclone I think the spitfire uh I feel like there was one other one that just came to mind the other day I mean I feel like even the Honolulu's are like pretty reasonably light at least for swing weight and I don't feel like they have any sweet spot issues so then I started wondering I was like I wonder how much of that is when paddles are a little bit more powerful if you're just getting

[00:32:18] more energy return in general and that's why they feel better because it feels like the power paddles that are light never really have sweet spot issues and then ones that are not as powerful but as light the sweet spot seems to perform worse because this I had no issues yesterday I'd probably add a little bit of weight just because it's light and I want some more plow through yeah but I didn't have any issues with the sweet spot or complaints about it so I'm very curious about people's perception with

[00:32:45] some light paddles but not others you know who knows so yeah I think very maneuverable I would probably classify this as low tier power out of the box I wouldn't call it all court yeah well yeah yeah I would agree without weight out of the box low tier power not not all court can hit pretty hard but it's not underpowered at all no yeah uh and what's crazy is that I'd probably put it below an

[00:33:11] omni hmm you know I think I might as well at least when the omni has the moi weights on it oh yeah if you take the moi weights off the omni hits then I'd be curious what the the swing weight and static weight differences are between them if you take the moi weights off of probably pretty similar omni might even be a little bit lighter possibly I think the omni probably would be lighter yeah so yeah it's interesting I mean I actually liked how the omni felt more without weight not in terms of sweet

[00:33:40] spot and stuff but like the actual feel of how the ball hit like one thing I've been noticing I should really pick like Justin's brain on this curious if he has any thoughts on it but I feel like I've noticed with a handful of paddles whenever you add weight or a good chunk of weight I feel like they often end up feeling stiffer so this happened with I feel like I'm just getting doing the whole volare command segment right now I'm just gonna save that but the omni is a great example of once you put the moi weights on it I feel like the paddle gets a lot stiffer like without

[00:34:09] the weights on it I feel it feels more plush soft I really like how it feels and then once you put the weight on I'm like oh it feels so like springy so stiff yeah or stiffer rather uh so I don't know what that's all about but interesting observation recently so yeah I'm I'm very excited to play with this paddle more this is one of the ones I think as one of my first ones back that I'm very excited

[00:34:35] doesn't seem to have any big like crazy EPP core yes it's interesting so for the hundred dollar paddles my top was the EPP turbo not the MPP not the MPP okay got it MPP is fun but I played infinitely better with the EPP yeah it's just how it is yep um but this if the grid actually holds up

[00:35:01] this might take over it's definitely less power than the EPP turbo but it it is very nice I like how it plays I mean I almost sometimes think even obviously look we all want a paddle that has long lasting durable grid at a hundred dollars like that would be awesome but even if not like it's still a hundred dollars you know like that's still like I mean look the EPP and MPP turbo whenever that came out was still a great paddle even though it didn't have a long lasting grid it's because it was

[00:35:30] a hundred dollars right you could buy two or three of it compared to some of the other long lasting grits or non long lasting grits like a pro five or something so even I'm very curious to see because it seems like you know results have been kind of split on this I feel like um Lewis has put a lot of time on it and he's like I don't feel like mine's lost a lot of spin John obviously had it in like tier three so I'm curious to see where it lands for us because we'll have both of us hopefully with a good

[00:35:57] amount of games on this to get data on it yeah and even the third one I might give it to another person and have them do some testing on it just to have even more data right you know so yeah early impressions Spitfire is awesome I see why people like it hopefully the grit is also awesome but we don't have enough data on that to actually give you an opinion on it yet but I'm really excited to play this one solid paddle solid paddle all right next paddle only you are gonna have some

[00:36:24] thoughts yeah you haven't hit this yeah yesterday when I was hitting the Spitfire since you had already hit the Spitfire I figured you should hit the Inferno 2 so you compared this to the regular for about an hour I've got nothing to contribute to this conversation yeah actually wait hang on sorry price 239 before code swing weight 119 static weight 7.9 that's all I got nice um yeah so I hit it side

[00:36:49] by side with uh an original Inferno and it is very interesting I'm sure the core design everything has stayed the same they've added you know whatever their marketing term blah blah blah grit is on it um arrow black surface yeah right on there I these all these silly names for different grit textures uh it feels so drastically different than a normal Inferno I wouldn't even call them the same paddle if

[00:37:17] you blacked out both paddles and had me play with them I'd be like these are two different paddles um which obviously it is changed different surface but the core feels very different like so the the Inferno we all know very thonky very hollow almost kind of like plush hollow just boomy right uh and

[00:37:42] very springy this is very stiff and hollow not like trying to think of what is like uh the Friday Aura Pro is very stiff very hollow maybe not quite as stiff as an Aura Pro but it's on the stiffer side sound very different I mean we haven't tested it long enough to know if this grit texture is actually going to last super long but playing with it side by side I had no issues generating spin from the

[00:38:08] baseline hands felt good uh I'm trying to decide what I would prefer feel wise to use because I've played qualifiers with the Inferno and I really like it but it can get a little squirrely sometimes and I feel like that's the downside of the more soft and hollow paddles is resets get tougher

[00:38:32] I feel like you can hit the ball harder but it's just just more squirrely this is probably going to be a little bit easier like drives it was easier to keep in play um it's tough I was hoping uh sorry to cut you off there I was hoping John would have uh an x-ray in his uh database of the uh Inferno 2 but he doesn't yet because I tried looking at Luz's marketing and it doesn't it doesn't

[00:38:56] tell me anything yeah so yeah solid paddle is just if you if you play with an Inferno and think okay I want a better grit texture I'm gonna buy this one be prepared for it to be like a very different paddle yeah it's it's not the same um but otherwise I think it's good it's expensive for sure um but I think it plays plays well I like it still very like very high on the power scale here's the question

[00:39:24] though which would you take between the two that's what I was just trying to figure out um because is there something you think one is better for over the other or is it just purely a feel thing it's purely a feel thing I I just think one like I almost think this one if you are okay with the stiff feeling this is gonna be slightly easier to control in my opinion um I could probably see that I'm

[00:39:51] guessing just without even hitting it based on what you're describing that I am probably the person that the Inferno 2 would be easier to use for because the the first Inferno I was the type of player who just had such a hard time controlling it I know you struggle with drops yeah yeah yeah so yeah it's tough it's just don't expect it to be a typical Inferno I think it's good yeah I had no issues with it no complaints but it's not the same it is different which I mean you would hope if

[00:40:18] it's called Inferno 2 I hope it's different in some way right but if you really like the feeling of the original Inferno that really hollow thonky uh poppy feel but then just wanted a better grit texture a more durable grit texture because Luz has had very bad track record on peel ply they're like they just had bad track record with grit every time they come out with a new type of grit it does at least according to John it's not good grit in general yeah but like the original Infernos bro I

[00:40:46] was cooking through those things very fast yeah like those things lost spin crazy fast so yeah we'll see I mean we'll put more testing on this and see see if it lasts any longer but and it's fine I just think uh there's definitely getting better for cheaper now like if I had to choose between a spitfire in this or two spitfires in this I'm probably taking the spitfire yeah you know that's the thing is we're at an interesting era in pickleball where I feel like following up the

[00:41:16] previous paddle with the same name is going to be really hard like everyone really liked the Inferno so the I in my opinion like take the Loco 2 for example if it is literally just a regular Loco with a longer lasting grit that actually lasts like I said before awesome that's all it needed it didn't need more I feel like similarly with the Inferno it was so popular that all it needed was

[00:41:41] a better real long lasting grit and then that is good enough but I feel like if you change feel a lot it's really hard because what are we making better at this point the sweet spot on the Inferno was already good a lot of people already liked the feel profile maybe it was a little heavy but that can always be a good or a bad thing depending on who you are as a player so following up the original Inferno to a two is not easy like you know what I think will probably be the all-time hardest paddle

[00:42:10] to follow up in pickleball that the boomstick what do you make better if you make a boomstick to how do you make it better the only thing to me is that you change the grit to something that's actually good yeah because it already had a massive sweet spot they weren't heavy uh well it's it's the non-flashy

[00:42:33] stuff right so like things that people complain about but don't notice until you've used it for a while so yeah grit and a better grit texture is is one and that's something that I think any pal like an Inferno or Loco too I think of it purely for me if it just had a actual better performing durable grit that's all it would need yeah but say boomstick a lot of people had edge guard issues that was a big

[00:43:00] problem yeah so if they fix that but that's not a flashy thing no one cares about that one until you use it for a while it's a thing that shouldn't even have been you should you shouldn't have to think about it or face layers cracking because there's only two face layers that was happening all the time a lot of people complained about that they fix that but if you buy it a new version of boomstick two then those things don't happen then in your mind you're like yeah it's just expected so doesn't feel like anything changed and I think let's just because feel feel is one of those

[00:43:29] things that you're going to make some people happy you're going to make some people mad someone's going to want stiff and hollow someone's going to want soft and dense let's just make up something here and say a boomstick two was going to be soft and dense you're going to piss off a lot of people that really liked the boomstick being stiff and hollow and maybe make some of these people over here happy so I just feel like following up certain paddles is almost an impossible task with how good paddles have gotten kind of like you know with iPhones or something largely the smartphone is solved and good yes

[00:43:59] there are things you can continue to improve cameras battery whatever but those aren't things that make people go oh my gosh that is awesome we're talking about an extra hour of battery cool the new iPhone has an aperture blade like and you just can't please everybody yeah the feel thing is you just have different camps of people and whatever you come out with is going to please some and and upset the others I almost wonder if it's stumped some point we're gonna have I doubt it just because this is probably way too confusing

[00:44:26] for the manufacturers but if you were gonna do like I'm gonna make something up here like loco soft loco stiff you would probably come up with way better names than that yeah but like you have designated models of like look it's the same paddle but we tweaked one to be feel softer and one to well stiffer one you're gonna confuse consumers yes and two companies are gonna hate having so many skews yeah for sure like no company wants to have that many skews yeah so it would just be annoying

[00:44:54] for everybody I feel like I agree I agree so yeah I don't know I did all that to say I feel like following up the original Inferno was kind of hard unless you just fixed the grit yeah for sure because I mean I don't really be at size of grit I don't really think I heard people complain much about the Inferno I feel like I only ever heard good things you know yeah yeah I agree I don't know all right last battle we'll talk about here I'll be quick on this one since I feel like I already gave the

[00:45:19] rundown Valair Command uh got a bunch more games this week I think I'm in like the 30-ish game ballpark now and I added weight if you're watching the pod uh this is probably going to look like a pretty significant amount of weight to you which I guess it is this is one gram per inch and it's about seven to seven and a half inches on both sides I basically have it running from the bottom of the throat uh up most of the side and this is also lead tape because I finally ran out of one gram

[00:45:48] tungsten tape so I feel like a a caveman using lead I was playing with this and like my two-y you know I would my finger would kind of rub on it and I'm like I'm gonna die I'm like lead poison is gonna get me uh bro unless you're eating yes I know I know you're fine I know but it's just been so long I was like don't touch it don't touch it I feel like people will treat I mean yes lead is is a toxic

[00:46:12] material but I feel like some people treat it like it's uranium it's radioactive yeah right uh so okay so that's my weight setup and now like I said a lot of you probably going wow that is way too much weight Chris way to ruin the paddle it's still not heavy it is 115 swing weight which is where most hybrids start and static weight okay maybe it's a little on the higher ish end it's about 8.3 ounces now but let me go check really quick see if I can can't remember if I put this back on my website

[00:46:44] here studio database boom stick I should hit that sometime because I'm very curious to see what I think of that weight setup I don't think I would dislike it but I I am almost positive I would change it from from that setup I'd be curious I kind of feel like you'd like it I feel like you might there might be one you prefer more but so okay real quick in my database boomstick I think we can all agree is probably like currently one of the most popular paddles on the market right yeah my the wide body

[00:47:12] that we measured 8.5 ounces and the elongated 8.3 ounces so before I hear complaints that 8.3 ounces for a paddle is too heavy go tell that to all the boomstick users out there that are swinging that thing around and loving it the whole static weight thing man people get way too hung up on the kind of forget about static omni 8.23 ounces wide body 8.2 for the elongated so look 8.3 ounces is fine none of you are gonna die with 8.3 ounces we know some people that are like if it's over

[00:47:41] seven seven seven set I won't even touch it'll break my arm yeah and I'm like you stop don't don't do this so yes not that heavy uh and playing with it I didn't I wasn't like oh my gosh not maneuverable like I had no complaints um 115 is still pretty reasonable it just starts very light so anyways uh pretty much fixed all the issues I had with it I still the only thing I haven't gotten to do yet

[00:48:04] is play some competitive games at my level so I have drilled with this now uh with this weight setup and then I have I did play a bunch of games one evening but it was at an event at a facility so the level of play was kind of all over it was you know a mix of three five up to about four five and a lot of just mixing in of different levels so play was kind of all over so maybe not the best example of you know maybe I wouldn't have had a sweet spot complaint when it was stock because

[00:48:32] I'm just receiving an easier ball than I'm used to but so far every complaint I had about the sweet spot is gone now like it feels manageable feels solid um the only thing like I was saying about the spitfire and other paddles with adding weight is that the softer more hollow feel that it had I feel now it is stiffer and so I feel like I'm losing out on some of that I liked that softer feel it's not

[00:48:58] completely gone but I was like hmm wonder if I'll have to change the weight setup at all to bring that back because to me that is one of the more have you always preferred softer feeling paddles no uh I wouldn't even say it's I have a strict preference I feel like I just kind of bounce around and depending on the paddle like for example the loco pretty darn stiff I would say I also the aura pro I think is really good also a stiff paddle um but there are just certain paddles where I think

[00:49:26] I think I like the feedback of softer more but I will get over it if I feel like the performance of a stiffer paddle is fine yeah um so when I hit a soft one I'm like oh I really like how this feels I'm just trying to think because I feel like we've we've flip-flopped on our preferences yeah I feel like it does I I was in the uh the soft and hollow camp as donkey as possible and now I'm leaning more towards stiff and hollow like uh the planets orbiting we just keep keep

[00:49:53] opposite sides yeah so yeah I uh I'm pretty pleased with where this is at I think we'll see I probably only need maybe another like 20 30 games to you know really feel like I know this paddle and kind of where it sits but I think after the weight the coral pro is probably going to be this thing's biggest competitor I feel like they are firepower wise not far from each other I think there'll probably be some subtle differences maybe one has a little bit more pop or one has a little bit more power

[00:50:22] but I feel like it's really going to come down to which performs better the upa diamond tough which we haven't gotten to test yet I'm kind of just basing everything off of what john has said about it I know for him it was uh performed really well on the cannon and hex grit like I feel like that's what it's going to come down to because once this is has weight I feel like it's much more in the realm of a coral pro than it was initially so that's kind of where I'm sitting with it right now not a paddle that I think is going to absolutely blow your mind what's the price difference between

[00:50:50] this and a coral pro coral pro if memory serves me right is 220 before a code and this is 180 before a code so after code it's probably 160 versus 200 so that could play a factor in that as well I mean 40 is a pretty noticeable difference uh but you know coral pro has three shapes this currently has one shape and this is also a pre-order and the coral pro is not so yeah more time to kind of narrow that down but it's not going to be like a boomstick where everyone picks this up and it's like oh my

[00:51:19] gosh this is the most fun paddle ever it's like uh I think its biggest claim to fame right now is that it has hex grit and sits somewhere between a jelly bean and a power two so it fills a spot that a hex grip paddle didn't have and a slightly cheaper price point that is kind of what I think is making this uh more compelling so yeah that's that's what I have to say about this so far but yeah pretty good paddle all right I liked playing with it the other night I was I was having a good time

[00:51:47] with it yeah um and even the games I played last week uh actually it was playing some great pickleball uh last week I was like man I maybe I'm back maybe maybe after now that I've started hitting again I'm telling you guys when I first started getting back into this the first tournament I played man would that have been like a month ago now uh maybe like I'm almost a month and a half ago or something I was like I am so washed I was like I'm so bad at pickleball I was like I cannot believe

[00:52:13] I'm this bad now so it feels good to maybe suck a little less uh okay man you know it's funny I this I didn't say it at the beginning of this pod but as I was making this pod I was like man this is gonna be like a 40 minute pod this morning and then it ends up when you texted me that and you're like or we were talking the other day and you're like yeah we're gonna have to scrounge up for uh a decent length pod and I'm like no we don't no we won't maybe you know maybe we'll do like how long do you think we're at right now what do you think uh camera's not really saying what does this say

[00:52:42] I can't read it from here it's an hour oh we're at an hour all right we're just gonna go straight to q a and we're gonna save that topic for next week in case because I bet you next week we're gonna need it well that or if we talk about this this we could be on an hour for this topic alone exactly that's why I'm like we'll save it I sometimes guys there are weeks where coming up with a whole pod is not an easy task there are definitely weeks where it's like man what are we gonna talk about this week sometimes nothing happens in the pickleball industry and it's just slow and

[00:53:11] other times there's too much yeah so all right we're gonna jump to some q a and we'll save the paddle uh review process for next week all right first uh one I guess this question is kind of already answered if you listen to this segment yeah have you hit the yola fx nope not yet but as soon as we have hit it we'll let you know this one I think will be an interesting one uh the franklin ball with the franklin ball coming out will it replace lifetime so I had you

[00:53:37] bring a franklin ball to a group and you told me that hold on before you say that okay my answer is going to be potentially and also no because amongst at least here in minnesota high level people and this is common amongst every group every state every person I've played with in high level groups are all stubborn as frick man yes they are no one wants to use or try anything different I actually don't

[00:54:06] even think that is a high level thing I mean think about the amount of people I mean my wife having worked at a facility she would tell me all the time how picky people will be like no it needs to be a diet in ball people are so picky they're so picky about so like one let me just give my opinion on the difference between them now let me preface this with we don't have a ball yet that has reached full break-in this whole break-in crap I know but I'm just that crap is important because a fresh lifetime

[00:54:33] ball versus a used one very different no we compare when I was at that group we used a brand new lifetime ball okay played with a brand new lifetime ball and then use this okay so let's just start with color Franklin 12 million times better than lifetime is the most garbage color ball I've ever seen in my life and I will die on that hill I don't care what anyone says I do think everyone agrees with you on that die on that hill I've never heard someone disagree except maybe me I'm neutral

[00:55:02] Franklin is so much better in color now the Franklin ball bounces like a bouncy ball this thing but if you thought that when we got introduced to the lifetime ball thought it bounced high bro Franklin what's it to shame the first game we played it was just everyone was ripping this thing because it is so fast with the paddles we have now so like wasn't even fun and one guy kept complaining he's like it's

[00:55:28] impossible to hit a drop and I'm like no it's not you just want to keep ripping drives sure uh so everyone's complaint was it's too fast it's hard to reset it bounces too high and I got like two games out of people and they refuse to use it anymore yeah so I unfortunately was not able to get much testing time on it because no one wanted to use it you and I are gonna have to do some drill sessions at some point it's kind of tough just because we're in the middle of testing paddles and you don't

[00:55:56] want to change the ball as a variable in the middle right but you and I really need to just take one ball and play with it for a handful of drill sessions where that's like our only ball to break it in and then compare it to a used one because I'm very curious once it's because I mean everyone said the same thing about the lifetime last year right like I mean I'm the same way when a lifetime is brand new if I go to a tournament the first thing I tell people if we are handed new lifetime balls I look at my opponent I say I've got a used one in my bag would you rather use that

[00:56:23] I've never had someone tell me no a brand new lifetime ball is not that bad I would much prefer a new one over a used one no it's so fast that is yes that is the point all day long give me a new one overused that is how they are initially intended to be used no okay no no no no no okay when you go to the store if you're marathon do you want me to give you a pair of shoes that have been run 200 miles in them or do you want brand new shoes no but the difference is I

[00:56:50] think the lifetime ball is past what we want when it's new and then when it's used it's like this is a normal ball get used to how it's supposed to be I don't like it although I mean I've gotten used to the ball still don't like it but that's just how it is get used to it so my prediction is without having gotten to play the Franklin um you know broken in so taking performance aside I think

[00:57:16] Franklin probably has a very a much higher likelihood of penetrating the mass market with this ball because one there's so many people I'm still willing to bet you the Franklin x40 is the most popular ball across the nation agreed as a ball so Franklin releases a new ball people are more likely to try it hey this one doesn't crack as often let's start using that because they last longer you know

[00:57:41] so I think it'll be interesting to see what the divide is I think you think the US Open will switch to this oh that'd be really interesting yeah I feel like I heard the APP switching to this ball the new Franklin yeah the new Franklin okay yeah I mean that'd be interesting to see uh because I feel like the regular x40 is so slow especially yeah I was gonna say out in the heat in Florida it probably you'd probably be loving it yeah but I think people like you or I who play a lot of PPA tournaments or

[00:58:09] depending on what the local tournaments do will continue to use the lifetime ball unless all those tournaments start switching to the Franklin because we're already used to it it's what we use for work it's what we use for PPA tournaments so there's not a real incentive for us to switch but if you take regular amateurs who maybe aren't playing tournaments as much okay lifetime ball has been kind of hard to get I already know this brand Franklin I like their other ball let me just use that so I kind of feel like there's going to be a big split between the lifetime and the Franklin come maybe next year

[00:58:39] I and when this ball is officially out because I don't think it's officially out yet I don't see many higher level groups switching yeah I would agree with that people are just stubborn uh okay how's the Yola Pro 5 durability now that they've been out longer so I think there's two things that kind of go hand in hand with this one I we've said this before I just don't see as many Pro 5 so it's like okay am I seeing the issue less because there are less of them in the wild or are they actually better

[00:59:06] it's probably a mix of both because honestly I feel like with the Pro 4 I still heard a lot of complaints the Pro 5 I really yes people have core crushed them obviously but I don't feel like I hear about it nearly at the same rate so the stuff they were talking about to try you know the little at the top the reason worked the reason why I don't I mean the people I do hear from are lifetime employees who get them for free and use them and they'll probably core crush any gen 3

[00:59:35] mm-hmm thank you usually coaches yeah they're still core crushing them um or some sign players the people I just you don't hear it as much because they don't buy them and the market has gotten so much more flooded with good paddles they're like okay why am I gonna spend 300 when I can get a good hundred dollar paddle yep and they just there was one guy who was a diehard Yola fan

[00:59:58] he would only use Pro 4 or gen 3 like that was his favorite paddles he doesn't even use them anymore yeah so I just I feel like it is because a big part of is because there's less of them yeah hard to say but yeah I really don't hear much complaint at this point so if you have if you use a lot of pro 5s let us know down in a comment uh because it's been out for a bit now so you know there should be enough people if you've been maining it for a while we'll hear about it yeah

[01:00:25] all right next one what are your main paddles go ahead you can start I just like don't really have a main right now I'm just swapping between everything but if I had to pick I'd say or a pro okay I also don't really have one right now because I've been waiting you know to get through this slew of paddles to make sure like oh hey maybe there's one I really like that uh I haven't gotten to test yet

[01:00:48] so I don't really have one uh I still really like the spartus p1 uh the first tournament back that I played I played with the wide body of that and I was really vibing with it so I guess if I had if you told me right after this podcast I'm going to a tournament I'll probably just bring that but I also feel like I could probably bring a handful of paddles and be fine yeah like here's the thing the the life of a paddle reviewer is there is no main because you're constantly going to another

[01:01:18] paddle yeah you know like last year everything the loco I would say was definitively my main because I used it for so long and for chasing 5-0 but like if I'm in a heavy paddle reviewing season there's no such thing as a main if I'm playing pickleball I'm playing pickleball for work I don't really get to play pickleball for my own just pure enjoyment that often anymore so it's like okay if I'm going to be on court I should probably be testing something yep so that's that's my answer

[01:01:42] um next one should I buy the same paddle when mine wears out so I get this question a lot yes I just yes a lot of people they're like hey so my paddle wear out wore out uh and then my first you know should I buy a new one or like what should I do get a different paddle or buy the same one and I always go did you like the paddle like oh I loved it I'm like then yes buy the same one because unless you're into gear and you just like trying paddles which is also cool too right that's like why

[01:02:10] we like this job you should just stick with the same one it'll be way better for your game dude I get this question all the time it's like yeah my paddle's wearing out should I buy something new or should I stick with this I want to try these do you think it compares and I'm like if you like this just stick with it there's no reason to switch especially if you don't have a big complaint yeah you know if you told me man I just hate the handle length on this thing it like really drives me nuts to be like okay well maybe let's consider some new options but if you tell me you like

[01:02:35] 85 to 90 percent of that paddle just just stick with it yeah for sure better for your game I mean one of the best times of my pickleball career was last year during the chasing 5-0 series where I for the most part only got to play with like one paddle for a pretty long stretch of time and I was like wow so much easier to not switch paddles it's so much better for your game when you can just get

[01:02:59] used to a paddle yeah you know yep so yeah stick with one uh paddles for people who want all court to control with durable grit currently it seems like there are only I would say about two good options sounds like the coral pro again we haven't put that through our own testing so take that for what it's worth but it sounds like it's been good for everyone else and then the 11624 jellybean 2 you that jellybean 2 being the control side and the coral pro all court being on the all court side

[01:03:29] yeah those are pretty much your only options and both seem to be great so yeah yeah pick pick whichever one depending on we have we have a review of the jellybean 2 but not the coral pro but there should be plenty of the coral pro I'm sure other reviews at this point um how much time do you spend testing paddles versus your main well I guess I actually just answered that question uh yeah there's like zero percent time spent on a main like I'll tell you what testing is infinite the only time a main

[01:03:55] starts getting picked up for me is when I'm like in the week of a tournament and I'm like okay I should probably lock in a little bit and not suck at this tournament that's when my main is getting used and then at the tournament yep you know yeah probably same thing for you yeah oh yeah yeah sorry I was waiting for you to move on I was just like I thought I said yes yeah yeah totally yep I was like hello uh okay kind of answered this one earlier as well but how long for these durable grit issues to get resolved

[01:04:24] it kind of depends what you want to consider resolved right like ones like hex grit and perma grit potentially uh six zeros upa diamond tough are performing well I just think there are other companies that haven't figured it out and it's going to take them a while you think resolve means like industry-wide it's like every company has it yeah I've my guess based on how they phrase this

[01:04:49] is more are we going to stop having like a controversy like the v soul tour or the apes like when is that going to stop like on one hand look at how fast technology spreads across the industry yeah like a year ago we had only a couple foam paddles every company now has foam paddles yeah so within a year it is industry-wide yeah that pretty much every company has a pretty good foam

[01:05:15] paddle but grit obviously is a little bit different I think in my opinion probably a little bit more difficult to quote-unquote perfect yeah so at minimum a year yeah yeah that's that's kind of my guess I think before it's really widespread and I would say you get to a point where you don't really have to question as much yep who has a durable grid and who doesn't uh but we'll revisit that in a year and

[01:05:41] see see where we're at but I hope it gets resolved because man it is so weeding through all the the marketing and whether it's actually long-lasting and then doing all the play testing and then people are getting different results and it's like what what is happening here it's a lot it's it is a lot uh last question best way to break into higher level groups so I bet you you and I will have very different answers for this question it's a really tough one I get this question a lot it's

[01:06:08] a tough one do you want me to go first let's hear yours okay so I feel like I had a kind of a unique entry into higher level groups because I feel like I got invited to much better groups than I should have been invited to very early in pickleball wait that still doesn't happen hey bro chill chill well with how long I was gone all our friends might have forgot about me they might not know who I am anymore yeah

[01:06:33] uh but initially you know I started out as like a 3-5 and we pretty quickly got connected with 4-5 and 5-0 level players but there was a number of reasons that it happened for me slash us is when I got in I could do a lot of photo work so there were just random people I connected with in pickleball like hey I could you know shoot some photos for you uh it'd be nice to get to know you or whatever and they just happened to be higher level people and then they just enjoyed being around me so

[01:07:02] like oh hey come play I also feel like pickleball at that time was a little bit better about uh including different levels of play than it is now I feel like people are a lot more particular today uh about how they want their games to look so I think it was a slightly different era but I think people just ended up liking me as a person they're like hey you know come play you know maybe you can play with some of the slightly lower level people and you can play a game or two with like the 4-5s

[01:07:29] uh because I'd get my butt absolutely handed to me so I feel like being a pleasant person I'm gonna say is 85 to 90 percent of the work if you're a great player and everyone hates being around you you're not getting invited no one wants to play with you so be a good person who is nice interested in other people not like this oh I'm interested in you because I want to get in your group it's like you're genuinely interested in the person I feel like that's kind of what happened

[01:07:55] with me uh so I feel like I kind of got lucky there uh and then you know obviously I kept getting better so then that made it easier to play in different groups because now it was oh the skill is not an issue it's now the skill is there and uh we like you as a person yeah uh so that's kind of my answer I might have a slightly different answer here in a second but I'm curious to see what you say yeah it's it's tough depending on what your public court situation looks like or maybe the facility

[01:08:24] you play at it can be very tricky because obviously the higher level groups and it kind of depends what are we qualifying as higher level because high you know if you're a 3-5 4-5 is higher level to you and are we just going your 4-5 5-5 because like I feel like even from 3-5 to 4-5 or 4-5 to 5-0 are different groups and different dynamics yeah I agree right like there's a much broader range of

[01:08:48] 4-5s and so it's probably easier to get in groups with them if you're lower but if you're a 4-5 there's a lot less 5-0s and it's gonna be much more tight knit and a little bit more difficult to get in but what I would say is if you have a public court system and people do let's say like a weekly challenge court thing like you said above all maybe not above all but very high up there I

[01:09:14] would say above all is attitude yeah like if you are just a friendly nice person that people will enjoy talking with off court and you're not crashing out throwing your paddle cussing like not doing those things people don't mind dropping level play a little bit that's totally fine myself included totally fine with that yep but also when you do get an invite or you go on to a challenge

[01:09:41] court you get in onto those courts into a game with those people that is you have to look at that as a test yeah and you have to accept the fact that you are either going to pass or fail yeah and if you pass you'll get invited to another game and if you fail you might not be able to come back for a little bit and you just need to work and get a little bit better till you can like that's happened there were times where I got invited to a group probably shouldn't have been there didn't play my

[01:10:07] best and I didn't come back for a week or two and you know maybe I had a friend who had a pity invite you know and it was like hey sorry guys I'm bringing this guy along yeah you know but like for me yeah it is it is a test and you just have to accept you either did well or did not yeah and you just have to work better so you can kind of keep up with those people or ask one guy who's maybe slightly above you and kind of in those groups to just drill yeah and if you can drill

[01:10:33] with those guys because like drilling at a a gap level is not that bad sometimes yeah and so if you can I mean I let you drill with me and I'm so much better than you that's crazy that's wild um how did your qualifier go it was great your first qualifier it's great we we drew a really tough match oh and out you know I'm about the same record as Zane these days you know that's crazy

[01:10:59] I don't know Zane seems like he's playing the first day and then just headed home so I'm about as good as bro so true so true um but yeah I agree yeah that's that's kind of just how it is with high level groups and if there's like like you said with a weekly challenge court don't be the person who is like hawking the court to like try and get like jump in immediately at games over because people will just kind of wait and go out and not like if you're like really desperate to try and

[01:11:28] play with them it's gonna be a lot harder for you to get on courts you just have to kind of be like hey like can I play a game with you guys see how it goes also I think there's a lot of a the challenge court thing you said is great which you know it very in very limited scenarios exist in Minnesota but largely we don't really do that here which I am actually bummed about I wish it was a bigger thing actually be great for the kind of ecosystem of pickleball but if you are in a state that does

[01:11:56] that I mean one you can just get in the games because okay you can probably just set your paddle down and get a chance to play with these people but also I think there are other ways you know uh we have a lot of indoor facilities so if you have a lot of facilities in your area it might be are there different types of open plays or events at that facility where it is you are able to play up a little bit you know if you're a 3-5 trying to go to a 4-5 open play that's probably not going to work because a lot of times they're duper gated I was gonna say that's usually the problem but if

[01:12:26] you're able to bump up just a little bit at a time that is the way that I feel like you know as you improve people usually take notice like there have been a lot of people in Minnesota that maybe they didn't start awesome and I would see them in a tournament but I would every tournament I'm like oh okay they got beat pretty bad last time now they got bronze oh hey they got gold this tournament oh hey now they're going up a level I feel like people just notice that so to me the the best way is just get better at pickleball you know drill just play more like I wouldn't focus so much on like

[01:12:55] I need to think of all these techniques to try and get on the court it's like being a nice person and also just getting better at pickleball helps oh and if you are this is a big one and I cannot believe this didn't pop in my mind immediately very curious to see what you say here if you are on a court with three people that you know you are the worst person there or you know you're much lower than your partner do not try to be a hero do not try and do crazy things and impress everyone on the

[01:13:25] court because it's not gonna work like I have had people jump on a court with two other guys and myself someone who's a little bit lower than all of us and is on the right side and tries to take every ball in the middle smacking my paddle while I'm trying to take a dink in the middle like you are not that guy this is not your time to try and show off and take every ball in the middle like you're just annoying me right I've never experienced that like that has been my experience sometimes when I get

[01:13:53] like say a 4-0 or a 4-5 in my group and they just try and rush the middle take every ball with their backhand they like are smacking my paddle while I'm trying to take an overhead they're like practically pushing me off the court because I think they're trying to almost prove themselves like that is just not that is not the time it's not necessary like you're just kind of annoying people if you do that right so kind of be aware of your surroundings as well not the time to try and be a hero I just

[01:14:20] said I've never experienced that and then I immediately thought wait I've never experienced that does that mean I'm that guy I'm that guy I'm the guy taking all the balls and people like Chris stop it and maybe that's not like always the case when someone lowers with higher level people but that has been my experience with some groups where like a lower level guy is on my team and and it's just like clanking paddles taking balls in the belt pushing me off the court you know what we forgot an even bigger one this is kind of the reverse of what you just said but let's say you have a

[01:14:49] higher level guy that does want to mix in but then it's three people who are silo yeah do not ice out the higher level guy yes this happens I mean at any level I have even had my wife who is probably about a 375 to 40 ish she's played some open plays where she'll mix down uh for work and then tell me stories of like dude no one would hit me the ball yeah and like I don't want to play if you're not going to hit me the ball because a lot of times what people do is they get in those games and they

[01:15:18] go I gotta win this game so I can tell my friends I won that game if you're just hitting to their weaker partner and ignoring them you didn't win that game yeah or sure you won the game but you didn't beat that person you beat the other guy there's a reason why there's a facility here locally that I I used to go to these like 5-0 open plays and sometimes there'd be like legitimately good groups of people but it is just impossible to keep high level people at an open play group um because lower level people

[01:15:46] leak in they let people in and then stuff like that happens where there was a there was a guy who I got in a group where there was two or two better players we're on opposite teams and then the two little bit lower guys and it was like skinny singles and I'm not in a tournament competitive mode I'm not gonna be poaching balls in an open yeah I'm not here to try and absolutely mess people up yeah you know so their goal was like I'm gonna beat this other person and they literally would brag to others like I beat Isaac

[01:16:15] in a game I'm like you beat my partner yeah you did not beat me yeah it's like don't don't do that if if a a higher level guy gets in your like group don't ice them out they just want to play pickleball they're not there to destroy you and maybe there's the occasional jerk that will like mix in with lower people and just poach everything and try and you know mess you up that's not usually the case but also it's like you know if you really are trying to get better that is your time to go what do I need to work on like we've had times

[01:16:44] where we've I mean a great example last year Tyra happened to be in the area and we got some games with her so you and her played and then Mia and I played together against you guys and I mean I was hitting balls to you that made sense but my objective was I'm gonna feed Tyra as many balls because I can't play with Tyra every day yeah like I would you know mess me up like hit me with the ball or something you know like I know what you can do I don't need to see how you play and it wasn't even you get bagged

[01:17:11] by me every day so yeah it just hit to hit to the the better player if that is an opportunity given to you because you may get to do that more often if it's a fun experience for them like at the end of the day what people care about on the pickleball court no regardless of your level is just having a good time I really wish I had this on camera a funny story just popped up in my in my memory bank um last year I was in a group of lower level people like quite a bit lower probably three fives also I

[01:17:39] feel like we have to say this every time we're on a podcast talking about it sounds so aggressive well it's not saying lower level sounds like a just you're bad at pickleball but I feel like the way we're using lower level is not you're bad at pickleball it's just it is a difference in level like yeah five five to four five is lower level there's nothing wrong with being lower it's just a separate there's a skill gap we almost need a better word for this I know you'd be misinterpreted so badly and we needed to put that disclaimer at the beginning of this yeah I'm gonna make it

[01:18:09] this far but I was in a group of people with probably probably like three five yeah probably round three five and I was getting iced out so bad that like the ball never ended especially at that big of a gap five oh plus to three five I'm not gonna be stepping on people's shoes poaching like yeah that's just ridiculous so I thought it'd be funny to the point where I got to the kitchen and I just never saw a ball I literally put my paddle inside my shirt and just started watching

[01:18:36] the point ball still never got hit to me I'm like this is insane yeah yeah so yeah just don't don't be that group because ice out better people the other thing too is like what I was saying about everyone just wants to have fun you know I went to that event a couple days ago and like I said the the play was all over the place like you know there was probably people as low as 3-0 there was people uh all the way up to about like four or five I would say maybe a little bit of 5-0 here or there

[01:19:03] uh I just didn't mix in with those and I had a great time like I wasn't it's not like it's impossible to have a good time when you're playing with people like if you're fun on the other side of the net and we can have a good time like maybe there's a little bit of banter back and forth or we can all laugh about doing something goofy yeah like I would have I had a great time and I was like I'll keep doing this all night I was not even that concerned with man we're the the 5-0 guys like I want you know it might have been fun to go get a game with that group or whatever but I was

[01:19:32] having a great time playing with everyone else so as long as you're just making it fun for everyone yep you know like for example if I got on one of those courts and let's say one of the 3-5's objective was like I need to win this game and they were just throwing a tantrum every time they missed a ball I'd be like yeah I don't want to play with that guy again that was really awkward yeah like I just want to have fun 100% you know also the other thing is people ask me all the time how do I get better faster play with better people you like the fastest way to improve

[01:20:01] is to get absolutely beat up because you will just see those shots get used to that pace get used to the angles and you'll just learn you will adapt so I have an interesting thought about that because there's a there's a certain range you know a 3-5 is not going to be getting better drilling with me going all out I would say half a point up yes but even then I agree with what you said I do think that is one of the fastest ways to improve that's why I'm saying don't ice them out yeah if you want

[01:20:31] to get better mm-hmm get beat up by them it's inevitable because you'll learn like oh my resets kind of suck yeah or whatever it is maybe it's some you know your footwork but I think what's also a lot of times people will overemphasize that a little bit where sometimes they go well the only way I'm gonna get better is if I have high level guys like oh if I can't get in high level games then I can't get better at pickleball I also think that's right yeah yeah I think the main objective

[01:20:57] every time you play open play drilling whatever it is you should go in with one objective I've done this a bunch and I it's always when I have the most rapid improvement is I pick a thing and I'm like that's the only thing I care about this game I don't care if I win or lose because losing one while you're learning a new technique is inevitable you're gonna play worse but here's a great example I had a session last year where my only objective was to get my serve as deep as

[01:21:23] possible I wasn't saying I need to win this point I didn't even care what happened after the point I didn't even care if I lost the game I filmed it I went home I put it in PB vision and I was like did I achieve the goal that I was trying to achieve which was get the serve deeper and I looked at it and it was like 90% of my serves were within three feet of the back line and I was like that's all I want to do I actually if I recall correctly I lost most of those games but people did tell me during

[01:21:50] that session they're like dude your serve got a lot better all I did was hit it deeper yeah I don't even know that I was hitting it a lot harder so big when you go in with the mindset of here's the thing I'm gonna work on today am I doing it yes or no like if even walked into sessions before where my other objective is I am only going to cover the line whatever side I'm on like if the ball is right in front of me and I know it could go down the line because I get made fun of all the time by my guy

[01:22:14] never covers the line so I was like I'm only gonna cover the line and so if it went past my left shoulder and it was kind of unreasonable for me to get I'm like my partner's ball like I this is what I wanted to cover and what I should cover so that's my that is that is a crazy topic that maybe we'll have to write down for another pod sometime or just like a coaching segment man I've had some people where I'm coaching and I tell them like they're like okay but if I speed up here and it goes down the line

[01:22:44] what if what if he's like a recent example he's like I speed up down the line and I feel like a lot of the times the ball goes through the middle and I can't cover both I'm like your job is not to cover both yeah you know you have to cover the line and your partner needs to get the other that's a longer conversation we can maybe get into another time but that happens all the time yeah yeah I mean same thing that is has always been a big thing for me I try to cover too much which means I'm really

[01:23:10] covering nothing yeah so I I need to just concede that sometimes it's got to be your partner uh that is doing the other thing but man we we turned that question into a whole segment that was like 15 minutes worth of conversation we had a lot to say that was a good uh a good question so let's just summarize let's summarize this simply be a good person don't be a jerk be pleasant to be around and I but I get it you know like this is your opportunity people get amped up and really want

[01:23:39] to try and prove themselves because like this is what I've been waiting for I really want to get in this yep but you gotta just like let go of the ego and let go of the emotions and just be a friendly person because I like you said I swear that will take you so much further I mean that's just a good life rule bro I mean true that's true it applies to pickleball but that's just a good life rule all right uh you know what what word are we gonna do this week I didn't really you know I gotta

[01:24:04] get better about this dude how do we always forget we're gonna we're gonna go with uh let's let's just go with three five this week you know we'll put it put it as three five sure we'll go with a three five joke this week actually you know what give us your best three five joke yeah that's what we'll do give us your best three five joke I like who's clever in the comments sweet all right thanks for listening guys and uh we'll catch you next week peace